The Freq Show

36. The millionaire next door mindset

• Sam Thurmond & Jaclyn Steele Thurmond • Season 1 • Episode 36

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In this episode, we’re diving into The Millionaire Next Door Mindset—and trust me, it’s not what you think. Sam and I get real about what it takes to build financial security without falling into the trap of flashy spending or societal pressure.

We talk about the small, daily decisions that add up to big results, the power of delayed gratification, and how aligning your financial goals with your life values can create lasting freedom. Plus, we share some personal stories (and lessons learned) along the way.

So, are you ready to shift your mindset and take control of your financial future? Let’s get into it!


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Jaclyn:

Hello and welcome to episode 36 of the Freq Show with Jaclyn Steele Thurmond and my husband, Sam Thurmond. Today we are going to be talking about the millionaire next door mindset.

Sam:

Yeah

Jaclyn:

Do you want me to set this up?

Sam:

Yeah, please do. I haven't read the whole thing, so you are the expert.

Jaclyn:

So I finished this book recently, and over the last couple of years, I have been working on my financial literacy. You know, growing up my dad was an attorney, so I grew up in a very comfortable middle class home, but then my parents got divorced and things changed very rapidly when I was 17, 18 years old, and so we went from being financially like very comfortable to not having financial security, and I think that instilled a lot of fear in me, very deep seated fear about money. And then I went to a very expensive college. I went to Baylor University, and I did have scholarship money, but I still had to take out student loans and ended up graduating with a very large debt load, and so over the last I'm 38 now. So over the last 18-ish years of my life, I have had a lot to work on with my money mindset and the way that I view wealth building.

Jaclyn:

I also went through a period and I talk about this on the Self-Worth Podcast especially when you were deployed the second time, I was really lonely and I spent too much money shopping. It was never one of those situations I don't think you would say though you are free to disagree with me where I was like racking up thousands of dollars of debt in shopping, but I would use the money that I made at my job to pay my student loans and pay whatever bills needed to be paid, and then the rest I spent. I was not a saver and it was one of my emotional ways of coping with stress and anxiety. And so as I've gotten older and I've wanted to not do that anymore, because it is not a good use of money and it just perpetuates the anxiety, right?

Sam:

Yeah.

Jaclyn:

It may be a temporary relief, but it's not permanent. I have wanted to really become financially literate. And how does one become financially literate? I think there are many ways of doing that. Reading books is great, classes are great. We need to have more financial literacy classes in our schools and in college.

Jaclyn:

But what came to mind for me was who is the wealthiest person I know and how can I get on the phone with this person? And it just so happens that the wealthiest person I know is my dad's best friend. Not going to name names, I'm not going to name his net worth, but it is multi, multi, multi millions. And we got on the phone with him a few weeks ago and we were asking him all kinds of different investing questions and how he got to where he is and how he did it. And he was so open and so excited to talk to us and one of the questions at the end I asked him was what books do you recommend that we read?

Jaclyn:

And the first one that he mentioned was the Millionaire Next Door and I ordered it on Amazon that day and then read it immediately. And it is a very unique financial literacy book because essentially the whole message behind it is. Anyone can become a millionaire because it's not necessarily about how much money you make. It's about how you manage your money and I love this perspective. I also love Kiyosaki. I love Tony Robbins, his financial literacy books, but I feel like this shift that occurred for me and I know I'm saying a lot, but the shift that occurred for me in reading the Millionaire Next Door was wow, this really is about money management and living a lifestyle under what you make, or what's the proper term, what's the proper way of saying?

Sam:

Living within your means?

Jaclyn:

Yeah, living within your means, um, or believing living below your means, which is where I really want to get, and so I thought it might be helpful for the listeners for us to talk about our takeaways from this book, talk about how we approach budgeting. For us to talk about our takeaways from this book, talk about how we approach budgeting. Talk about this specifically going into the holiday season, because this is when people spend a lot of money and encourage people, in a world of expenditure and materialism and keeping up with the Joneses, to march to the beat of your own drum and think about how you want to feel five, 10 years from now and what kind of financial portfolio you want to have, because it's possible, but it also requires planning and intention.

Sam:

Yeah, I think, as you were talking, I think we've gone through phases and they talk about that in the Millionaire Next Door Not necessarily the phases, but the two aspects of one, making money and two, saving money. And I think, you know, way back in the day, when we were first married and you know, I was a lieutenant in the Air Force and you were working your job and we had a set income, it was much more about saving money and I was kind of the hawk at that point in time. You talk about when I was deployed and I would uh, I would check the, the bank account regularly and question her on why she spent $25 here, why she spent $50 here and that sort of thing.

Jaclyn:

I think you had you had a notification that anytime more than a hundred dollars was spent on the credit card, it would like notify you.

Sam:

Oh yeah.

Sam:

Yeah, Um so yeah, and I was hawking at that point in time, because when you're deployed, you get, you're being paid tax free and, depending on where you are, you're getting hazard duty or combat pay. So you're making a lot more money than you normally would because you're not paying taxes and you can just save so much. And on my first deployment that was the case. No-transcript. Um, so the book talks about being a very, being very good at making money, and I forget what they called, uh, being very good at playing. Offense is what they talk about.

Sam:

So some people are very good at playing offense but they're not good at playing defense and most of the millionaires that they interview and survey in that book you know they're making. It was written in the 90s so they were making like 50 to 100, 125 grand. These very middle class jobs, but they made up the majority of the millionaires and it was just because of their practices and their discipline in that process over time that made them successful.

Jaclyn:

Yeah, the book divides achievers of wealth into two categories P-A-Ws and U-A-Ws and P-A-W. What does the P stand for? I know my brain just let it go. But the P-A-W is somebody who is a overachiever of wealth, so to speak, meaning they manage their money really well and they, on average, have a higher net wealth for their age and job than other people do in same age age range and job salary. And then UAWs are underachievers of wealth, so people who make good salaries but tend to spend all of it or more and their net worth is much lower than what would be expected for people in their profession and age range.

Sam:

Yeah, there's a calculation that determines this is how much you make on an annual basis. You multiply that by 40 and then divide that by 10, I believe, and that's what they say your net worth should be. So if your net worth is under that, regardless of how much money you're making, you're an under.

Jaclyn:

Achiever of wealth.

Sam:

Yeah. Is it achiever or accruer of wealth?

Jaclyn:

Achiever.

Sam:

And if you're over that, you know you're positive, you're a good achiever of wealth. So I thought that was interesting and so far you know we've done, we've gone hard and we've Prodigious, prodigious achiever of wealth.

Jaclyn:

Is that what it is? Yeah, maybe I think it is prodigious.

Sam:

But you know we've gone hard and we've leveled up in so many ways.

Jaclyn:

We've taken yeah.

Sam:

And we've acquired rental properties. We've created a portfolio, but a lot of those, like a lot of investors early on, you know you're doing that with debt. You're not. You know you don't have a million bucks to just go out there and buy rental properties that are now free and clear and their cash flow and you know you have all this equity. So we have acquired this portfolio but there's not incredible amount of equity in those. There will be over time as principal gets paid down and that sort of thing, but you know, we've got some work to do.

Sam:

I think is basically the takeaway.

Jaclyn:

We do have some work to do, but I'll say, when I did the calculation, we are very close at our age and in our profession to be prodigious achievers of wealth, which is the PAW camp, and that is a commitment that I am very stern on because of the situations we have encountered being entrepreneurs. We've had two very distinct periods, actually three distinct periods of time, where we were like are we going to lose it all? One was in 2019, where there were several deals that happened. One of the properties burnt down and it actually saved us because we got insurance money, but we had like 15 grand in credit card debt and I was like we're never going to be able to take a vacation again. What are we doing? Right, you know, and our expenses were low, but we had taken so many risks.

Sam:

Fast forward five years and we have 300 grand in credit card debt.

Jaclyn:

Not anymore.

Sam:

Not anymore, but it's just it's funny to look back.

Sam:

It's not funny, but it's just looking back.

Jaclyn:

But I think when you say stuff like that, we have to explain it so people don't think we're just spending a bunch of money.

Sam:

But it's the reality.

Sam:

It's the reality of things which we can circle back to that too, and that was all for investing in properties and doing work on properties, so it wasn't like we were spending it on-

Jaclyn:

Louis Vuitton and Land Rovers, but I'm super committed to that because of what happened in 2019.

Jaclyn:

Then what happened in 2021, where there was a lull with your business and some. You know we're in the pandemic still. We were at the time living in our RV. It was like month eight or nine and there was a storm out and it was shaking the RV and it our lives just felt so flimsy like inside and out and I was like, is this going to be my life forever?

Sam:

Yeah, yeah. Well, we had switched strategies from like flipping and wholesaling, which were faster, you know, bigger pops as far as injections of cash, to a almost completely cash flow play.

Jaclyn:

Yeah.

Sam:

And didn't factor in. Hey, we have to like make ends meet in this time.

Jaclyn:

Yeah

Sam:

So that was kind of the gap,

Jaclyn:

That's when Sam was still working with his other business partners.

Jaclyn:

Yeah, we were not business partners yet. Yeah, during that time. And then this past summer, where we had just finished the renovation on our personal home but we had poured so much money into Villa Secreta and it sat on the market for two months, which, in the scheme of things, for the price point that the property was.

Jaclyn:

And for the market here in the summer, that's not a long time at all, but those two two and a half months felt like two two and a half decades because our cash flow was so low. And speaking of the credit cards, Sam and I worked with a company that got us zero interest credit cards for 12 to 18 months, and so we were able to put some investment expenses on those credit cards with zero interest, and so that's why we did that. So when he says we had $300,000 in credit card debt, we did, but it was all intentional, and then, after we sold that property, we were able to pay it off.

Sam:

Yeah, and it was business credit, it wasn't personal credit.

Jaclyn:

Yeah, it was business credit. I. Otherwise I don't recommend using credit cards for like renovations. It's a little different with our business, because we do renovations for business Right, but if you're doing personal renovations on your house with 24% interest rate, that's sticky.

Jaclyn:

It's going to be hard to pay off. So, with all of that in mind, after going through what we did this summer and I'm so glad that we did, because there are so many lessons and so many takeaways and so much faith that was built I also was like, okay, we have been so aggressive in our investment strategies that I want to pull back and create a very healthy nest egg so we are not taking down the days to when our bank account runs out. And again we have investment properties. So it's not a dire situation where everything would crash to the ground, but when you have very little cashflow because all of your money is invested, it does create a lot of financial pressure because you don't have money to live month to month.

Sam:

And that's the struggle of any business is cashflow and figuring that out and consistency. So we're not unique in that, but I think over time you have to make the adjustments, diversify a little bit, have multiple streams of income so you're not so reliant on that one aspect of business.

Jaclyn:

Yeah, and my mindset now, after having paid off some of this debt and we still have a little more debt to pay off but my mindset, moving forward, is a wealth building mindset and I've talked to my friends about this. It's fun talking to women about finances because it's not generally something women talk about, but I love talking with my friends about finances because, of course. But I love talking with my friends about finances because, of course, like we like nice things, but I don't like nice things more than I like financial freedom and more than I like the ability to sleep at night, because I know there's enough money in my bank account to last me for the next six months to a year. We're working up to five years and so I love having these conversations with women, specifically because you can ask specific questions like do you want to spend a thousand dollars on that bag and have that bag sit in your closet and, of course, you can enjoy it, and if it's something you will enjoy, I get it.

Jaclyn:

Whatever, I'm not trying to judge or do you want to take that thousand dollars and invest it and create ten thousand dollars, you know, 15 years from now? Um, and so I view money very differently than I used to rather than money like spending money for pleasure, which I don't think there's anything wrong with enjoying your money when you work hard. But I think that there has to be a caveat of if your goal is to be financially free, is this really worth the money that I'm about to spend on it, or does it excite me more to have financial freedom? And I think that that's a good litmus test question, like do I love this enough? Do I love this more than I love the idea of financial freedom? I love this more than I love the idea of financial freedom.

Sam:

Yeah.

Jaclyn:

And I don't want you to get like too militaristic about it. I think anytime we get too militaristic about anything, it can be damaging. So, like I told my friend the other day when she was asking me some financial questions, I was like, look, yeah, buy the clothes that you need to buy to feel good and to feel confident, but don't buy more than you need. Like buy a few things that are going to make you feel like a million bucks and then let that be enough. So I think there's a happy medium there.

Sam:

Yeah, I think that when you, when it can become fun to prefer, when it becomes more fun to um to see how much you can save.

Sam:

And that becomes the game that you play and that you derive enjoyment from. I think that's a big shift versus again like buy whatever you want to buy, but whatever that hit is that you get from buying that purse or those shoes or whatever it is. When you can focus on the enjoyment of like man, I'm really creating something, and I'm not only saving this money, but now I have the opportunity for this money to go make more money, as opposed to just being a liability or it's just gone in some depreciating asset, which most of the things that we buy are. Now. It's instead of digging a hole, you're building a mountain and that's just going to continue to grow, and so I think there's so much enjoyment that can be taken from that.

Jaclyn:

So the wealthiest person that I know, who I mentioned earlier in this podcast episode. He says have your assets pay for your luxuries. And so I think about that in terms of cash flow and rental properties. So, for instance, Sam and I would love to buy a second home on at least five acres of land, but we don't want to do that until our assets can pay for our luxuries. So we have to get X amount of rental properties with X amount of cashflow to be able to buy that property and have it not detract from the money that we're making right now.

Sam:

Yeah, unless the property can generate, unless the property can generate income as well. So, yeah, yeah, it's funny, it's all like basic stuff really, when you get down to it.

Jaclyn:

I don't think we talk about it enough in our culture. I think we talk so much more about consumption and what so-and-so has and what we're going to get next and what we're saving up for to buy versus financial freedom and how that feels in our souls and in our nervous systems.

Sam:

Yeah, Well, we are a nation of consumers. It's kind of how everything has been built and where we are subjected to nonstop marketing all the time.

Sam:

So it makes sense. But yeah, it is. It's, and that's what's unfortunate or fortunate is that it really is very simple stuff basic math, you know and it's really just comes down to discipline. On the saving and investing side comes down to discipline, and I think the kind of what I alluded to earlier earlier. What's interesting is you got to get early on. You're like you limit yourself based off of how much money you think you can make, so that you have that barrier to break through and open your mind to.

Sam:

you know opportunities are limitless as long as you figure out how to trade your time. Not trade your time for money that's what people normally do in their jobs but leverage your value for an exchange for money. So, breaking through that limited mindset of how much you can make but not losing track of the discipline in that process make but not losing track of the discipline in that process.

Jaclyn:

So that would be another good episode to talk about, because we've hired a money coach in the past, like, we've done a lot of work around money mindset because I think both of us came into the marriage wanting to create wealth but also being kind of wounded in the money department.

Sam:

Yeah, I think just limited.

Jaclyn:

Yeah.

Sam:

Limited. Of what we thought was possible or what I thought was possible. I'll speak for myself. But yeah, yeah, it's been an interesting road and all of the personal growth that has to take place from, you know, zero to a million or whatever, whatever you say, I don't remember who that was that we referenced regularly, which is funny. I don't know who it was.

Jaclyn:

I always just remember what they talk about but becoming the person. The true reward is becoming the person that is that millionaire that you have to become, to become that millionaire, so millionaire that you have to become, to become that millionaire.

Jaclyn:

So, um, yeah, it's all about growth.

Jaclyn:

It is, um, I think, couple, couple things to go over before we close out is that, going into the holiday season, it is common for people to spend a lot of money on gifts for them, for people to love, for ourselves, for whatever and I would just encourage you to think about your financial future and how you want to feel at the end of December.

Jaclyn:

That doesn't mean you don't buy gifts for people, it doesn't mean you don't reward yourself with something cool, but I would challenge you to set a budget, and set a budget for each gift, for each person, so that when you are done shopping, you don't have that feeling of like oh shit, I spent all of this money and now I'm going to have to work the next couple of months to pay this back, and you don't have that feeling of like why did I do this? I know that I've been there so many times where I'm like I want to prove to people how much I love them and get them these amazing gifts, and it comes from a good place, but then I shoot myself in the foot because I overspent on things that I didn't need to overspend on. So I think that that's just something to keep in mind moving forward. Again, I have an abundance mindset. Money can always be made, but I think it's very wise to manage our money wisely.

Sam:

Well, it's just going to take you that much longer to get to independence if you don't keep that in mind.

Jaclyn:

And another path to financial independence is through a book that I read a couple of years ago called the Millionaire Mind, millionaire Mindset or Millionaire Mind oh, secrets of the Millionaire Mind. That's what it is, secrets of the Millionaire Mind and there's a budgeting system in there that I immediately enacted and it is very easy to follow, and I think we have like four or five different checking accounts within our bank account, because I have a financial freedom fund, I have a necessities account, which is for our everyday expenses. I have a fun fund and I have a long-term savings for spending. I also have a giving fund and in there they have an education fund as well for further education for you or for your kids or whatever, which we do have an investment account for Roman that we put into every month. But I found that this budgeting system was very straightforward and it really empowered me to take over our monthly budget and really really stick to it, because it also includes that fun fund, where you get to spend the money that you're making, but within reason.

Sam:

And I think I would say that the business version of that book is profit first. It's basically same thing thing. You basically have different accounts for different aspects of your business, and it's same concept concept ultimately.

Jaclyn:

Are you doing that with our business?

Sam:

Of course, of course. Why are you going to call me out like that? I'm just saying it's a good book.

Jaclyn:

We're honest on this podcast. We're honest. So, yeah, like we are not sitting here and talking to you pretending like we have it all figured out, but I think we are on a very good trajectory moving forward. We still have some things we need to clean up, we still have some debt that we want to pay off, but I think we are moving in the right direction.

Sam:

Mm-hmm.

Jaclyn:

All right. So the last thing I want to say is that peace of mind is worth more than anything. It's worth more than a car, than a fancy house, than a purse, whatever, pick your poison. Peace of mind is worth more than that. So the question that I want to leave you with, unless you have anything else you want to add is how would your life change if you created financial freedom for yourself? We hope this was a valuable episode. Thank you so much for listening. Live on purpose. Live on frequency! Thank

Jaclyn:

you so much for listening to the Freq Show with Sam Thurmond and me, Jaclyn Steele Thurmond. We would love to connect with you via our website, beckonlivingcom beckonliving. com and on social media.

Sam:

You can find us on Instagram and TikTok @Beckon Living and you can join our email list to receive uplifting messages, podcast and business updates and discounts on high-frequency products just for our Freqy community. Cheers to high-frequency living!

Sam:

.